Brexit

[Onelife]

Hi Princess,

If the "patronising response" was sent via PM then l would have thought the contents of which should have stayed between you and the mod.......If, however, it is this response. ......

"Looking back on the posts with my MOD hat on I would say there are an extremely low number that are genuinely offensive.

Any that were will have been deleted. There are however an awful lot of frank exchanges that are directed at Jack but these are normally responses and / or playful banter between the various Members rather than aggression. If this were not the case then Jack would have complained or have stopped posting.

If some have been offended then that is unfortunate but the vast majority have not, those who have left this Topic have done so because of the never ending circles rather than for any other reason."

Regards MobyMod


...........then l think it is a fair and impatial response to your complaint IMHO. .....l certainly don't think it is in the mods remit to ask inderviduals how they are coping with certain passages of text on this forum.

Regards

keith

[Golden Princess]

The "patronising response" was sent via PM and so will stay between me and the mod and the other members that were copied in to his response. I did reply but that was ignored by all. l, also, certainly don't think it is in the mods remit to ask individuals how they are coping with certain passages of text on this forum. I was merely questioning some of the assumptions made in today's reply on this forum.

[Jack Staff]

As far as I'm concerned, the elephant in the room is what the EU intends to become, and that is never discussed by either side.

At the moment, it's speculation as is almost all of the Remain arguments, but the EU intentions have been very widely publicized.

To pretend that the EU will stay the same is like trying to pretend that it it what we joined all of those years ago.

To gauge current opinion depends entirely on what question you ask.

How about

Leave the EU and determine our own future
or
Remain in the EU, be ruled by Brussels and continue to pay in even increasing amounts of tax payers money while collaborating in robbing eastern Europe of the youngest and brightest people and admitting more and more supplicant poor counties looking for hand outs.

Has a slightly different ring to it ?

If the UK does not take this opportunity now, it will be buried for ever and our descendants will question why we did not leave when we had the chance.

Barney, your post is fantasy.
While there are some people who would like a federal Europe, there are many that don't. The EU is democratic, so can't happen until people want it.
But, while we remain members we have a veto on this and can stop it. Once (if) we leave we then have no say in the future of the EU and when we rejoin we will have to take on whatever has be decided in our absence and with no veto on future decisions.

We are not in Schengen, or the Euro because we don't want to be.

For there to be a federal Europe the budget must be expanded greatly, there are obviously many member states that are not to keen on that.

The formation of the EU is that member states form the rules. Can't see many of them giving that up.

[barney]

Qualified majority voting Jack.
Surely you have heard of that.

"The EU is democratic, so can't happen until people want it."

Therein lies the problem.
When has the EU ever asked 'the people' ?

[Jack Staff]

Qualified majority voting Jack.
Surely you have heard of that.

"The EU is democratic, so can't happen until people want it."

Therein lies the problem.
When has the EU ever asked 'the people' ?

Didn't you vote for your MEP then?

[Onelife]

The "patronising response" was sent via PM and so will stay between me and the mod and the other members that were copied in to his response. I did reply but that was ignored by all. l, also, certainly don't think it is in the mods remit to ask individuals how they are coping with certain passages of text on this forum. I was merely questioning some of the assumptions made in today's reply on this forum.

Thank you for the clarification.

keith

[barney]

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/em ... spartanntp

I certainly don't remember voting for this.

Did you ?

I will confess that I have no idea who my MEP is and I'd challenge anyone to know this without the aid of Google.
The European Parliament is only there to ratify the laws of the Commission, a bit like the Polit Bureau in the days of the Soviet Empire.

We'll agree to disagree on this subject Jack.

You seem to see the EU as some sort of benevolent organisation whereas I see it as an insidious system that is looking to usurp national identity.

[Jack Staff]

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/em ... spartanntp

I certainly don't remember voting for this.

Did you ?

I will confess that I have no idea who my MEP is and I'd challenge anyone to know this without the aid of Google.
The European Parliament is only there to ratify the laws of the Commission, a bit like the Polit Bureau in the days of the Soviet Empire.

I am Facecloth friends with my MEP and two follow me on Twitter. But hey ho, if you don't engage with them, what do you expect?

The real idea about the 'EU army' is their bullets fit in our guns, which might be useful when a Russian tank appears over the hill (I believe there are about 1000 British troops in Estonia atm).

[barney]

Therein lies the difference.
I'm not on Facebook or any other Soshal Meedya

[barney]

https://www.politico.eu/article/michel- ... d-country/

Now, that would be an interesting Referendum.
What do you reckon.

Join or stay out ?

Anyone who says the EU are not being intentionally antagonistic ?

[Jack Staff]

https://www.politico.eu/article/michel- ... d-country/

Now, that would be an interesting Referendum.
What do you reckon.

Join or stay out ?

Anyone who says the EU are not being intentionally antagonistic ?

eh? That's what I (and the EU for that matter) have been saying all along.

We won't stay out if we do even leave, and will happily accept the new terms enforced upon us.

[barney]

Betcha wrong again, as you have been all the way along.

No wealthy country would ever vote to join the EU.

[Jack Staff]

Betcha wrong again, as you have been all the way along.

No wealthy country would ever vote to join the EU.

According to Brexiters the UK was the land of milk and honey before we voted to join.

[barney]

Betcha wrong again, as you have been all the way along.

No wealthy country would ever vote to join the EU.

According to Brexiters the UK was the land of milk and honey before we voted to join.

You speak rubbish Jack.

[Jack Staff]

Betcha wrong again, as you have been all the way along.

No wealthy country would ever vote to join the EU.

According to Brexiters the UK was the land of milk and honey before we voted to join.

You speak rubbish Jack.

So you agree the EU has been good for the UK?

[barney]

It's been ok but has held us back from being a global force. The future outside is much more promising in my opinion.

[Jack Staff]

It's been ok but has held us back from being a global force. The future outside is much more promising in my opinion.

I really can't stay (but baby, it's cold outside)
I've got to go away (but baby, it's cold outside)
This evening has been (been hoping that you'd drop in)
So very nice (i'll hold your hands, they're just like ice) ...

[barney]

You're weird

[Jack Staff]

You're weird

The world is made up of the US, Russia, China, the EU and RoW.
We are about to turn our closest 27 friends into competitors.
We no longer have an Empire to sustain us.

Baby, it's cold outside (of the EU)

[towny44]

It's been ok but has held us back from being a global force. The future outside is much more promising in my opinion.

I really can't stay (but baby, it's cold outside)
I've got to go away (but baby, it's cold outside)
This evening has been (been hoping that you'd drop in)
So very nice (i'll hold your hands, they're just like ice) ...

A bit childish even for you Jack and very patronising which, according to GP is the preserve of only the brexiteers on this thread.
I have to admit that as a free trade area the EEC was very good for us but only because Maggie rode to our rescue and squashed the power of the unions and allowed business to prosper.
Unfortunately as her power here and with a number of other EEC countries grew the Franco German alliance feared that a future president of the EU might not be from their clique, something they could not tolerate so they speeded up the move to a more federal EU, created the somewhat toothless Eurpoean Parliament, and the worthless MEPs, and foisted upon the unwary the Euro, via the ERM.
That of course may be a little simplistic and smack of a brexit conspiracy theory, but nonetheless that's the way a little more than 50% of the UK electorate feel, and the way they voted in David Cameron's once and for-all referendum.

[Jack Staff]

It's been ok but has held us back from being a global force. The future outside is much more promising in my opinion.

I really can't stay (but baby, it's cold outside)
I've got to go away (but baby, it's cold outside)
This evening has been (been hoping that you'd drop in)
So very nice (i'll hold your hands, they're just like ice) ...

A bit childish even for you Jack and very patronising which, according to GP is the preserve of only the brexiteers on this thread.
I have to admit that as a free trade area the EEC was very good for us but only because Maggie rode to our rescue and squashed the power of the unions and allowed business to prosper.
Unfortunately as her power here and with a number of other EEC countries grew the Franco German alliance feared that a future president of the EU might not be from their clique, something they could not tolerate so they speeded up the move to a more federal EU, created the somewhat toothless Eurpoean Parliament, and the worthless MEPs, and foisted upon the unwary the Euro, via the ERM.
That of course may be a little simplistic and smack of a brexit conspiracy theory, but nonetheless that's the way a little more than 50% of the UK electorate feel, and the way they voted in David Cameron's once and for-all referendum.

Thank you John, for explaining that for me.

[Mervyn and Trish]

Betcha wrong again, as you have been all the way along.

No wealthy country would ever vote to join the EU.

According to Brexiters the UK was the land of milk and honey before we voted to join.

We never did vote to join the EU. We voted to join the Common Market. It is governments who have rubber stamped the transitions through successive treatiea without further referenda.

[Jack Staff]

Betcha wrong again, as you have been all the way along.

No wealthy country would ever vote to join the EU.

According to Brexiters the UK was the land of milk and honey before we voted to join.

We never did vote to join the EU. We voted to join the Common Market. It is governments who have rubber stamped the transitions through successive treatiea without further referenda.

Because plebiscites are the tool of despots and failed politicians and have no place in the British Parliamentary constitution.

The mess this last one has caused, I am afraid, can only be corrected by another.

[Onelife]

Dear keefy,

The Government has responded to the petition you signed – “Stop possible second referendum on E.U. membership”.

Government responded:

A clear majority of the electorate voted to leave the European Union. We must respect both the will of the British people, and the democratic process which delivered this result.

The Government is clear that we will respect the result of the 2016 referendum, and that we will not hold a second referendum.

A clear majority of the electorate voted to leave the European Union in the 2016 referendum. Almost three quarters of the electorate took part in the referendum, resulting in 17.4 million votes to leave the European Union. This is the highest number of votes cast for anything in UK electoral history. This was the biggest democratic mandate for a course of action ever directed at any UK Government.

Parliament then overwhelmingly confirmed the result of the referendum by voting with clear and convincing majorities in both of its Houses for the European Union (Notification of Withdrawal) Bill.

In last year’s General Election, over 80% of people then also voted for parties committing to respect the result of the referendum - it was the stated policy of both major parties that the decision of the people would be respected. The Government is clear that it is now its duty to implement the will expressed by the electorate in the referendum - respecting both the will of the British people, and the democratic process which delivered the referendum result.

The British people must be able to trust in its Government both to effect their will, and to deliver the best outcome for them. As the Prime Minister has said: “This is about more than the decision to leave the EU; it is about whether the public can trust their politicians to put in place the decision they took.” In upholding that directive to withdraw from the European Union, the Government is delivering on that promise. We recognise that to do otherwise would be to undermine the decision of the British people, and to disrespect the powerful democratic values of this country and this government.

The Government therefore continues to be committed to delivering on the instruction given to us by the British people: working to overcome the challenges and seize the opportunities this brings to deliver an outcome which betters the lives of British people - whether they voted to Leave or to Remain.

The people of the United Kingdom gave a clear instruction and the Government is committed to seeing that through. We will leave the European Union on 29 March 2019.

Department for Exiting the European Union

Best wishes

Theresa xx




Sent from Samsung tablet

[towny44]

Betcha wrong again, as you have been all the way along.

No wealthy country would ever vote to join the EU.

According to Brexiters the UK was the land of milk and honey before we voted to join.

We never did vote to join the EU. We voted to join the Common Market. It is governments who have rubber stamped the transitions through successive treatiea without further referenda.

Because plebiscites are the tool of despots and failed politicians and have no place in the British Parliamentary constitution.

The mess this last one has caused, I am afraid, can only be corrected by another.

Are those not contradictory statements Jack?