Brexit

[oldbluefox]

(of course there are other reasons for independence, but the Brexit debacle is the one to create the majority)

As far as I am aware there has not been an independence referendum so I'm not sure where you get your "the Brexit debacle is the one to create the majority" assertion from. What is your evidence or are you making it up as you go along?
If you were correct then I would have thought this would be the ideal opportunity for Ms Sturgeon to push for independence again.

[Jack Staff]

That's simply not true Jack.

It is true because

(of course there are other reasons for independence, but the Brexit debacle is the one to create the majority)

Brexiters will just not admit the damage they are doing to the country, always trying to blame someone else.

[Jack Staff]

If you were correct then I would have thought this would be the ideal opportunity for Ms Sturgeon to push for independence again.

She is a politician. She knows her best time is once Brexit has happened. Independence will happen after Brexit.

[barney]

That's simply not true Jack.

It is true because

(of course there are other reasons for independence, but the Brexit debacle is the one to create the majority)

Brexiters will just not admit the damage they are doing to the country, always trying to blame someone else.

You are as ambiguous as usual Jack, but for the point of clarity, do you consider all 17.4 million people who voted to leave the EU as 'Brexiteers' ?
Do you consider all who voted to leave as 'causing damage' ?

[oldbluefox]

That's simply not true Jack.

It is true because

(of course there are other reasons for independence, but the Brexit debacle is the one to create the majority)

Brexiters will just not admit the damage they are doing to the country, always trying to blame someone else.

Do you ever read your own posts Jack?

[barney]

If you were correct then I would have thought this would be the ideal opportunity for Ms Sturgeon to push for independence again.

She is a politician. She knows her best time is once Brexit has happened. Independence will happen after Brexit.

She was always going to call for independence again, with or without Brexit.
That is their Raison D'etre.
And good luck to them if that's what they want.
You appear to have an issue with countries being self governing.
Trust me, it's normal.
That's the way a vast majority operate.
Some American was on TV last week bleating on about Brexit and the commentator asked if America would ever sign away their legislation to a foreign body?
You can guess that the guy could not answer.
It's simply not normal and is not what the UK population signed up for.
Trade deal - good
Political assimilation - bad

[oldbluefox]

If you were correct then I would have thought this would be the ideal opportunity for Ms Sturgeon to push for independence again.

She is a politician. She knows her best time is once Brexit has happened. Independence will happen after Brexit.

If that is what the people of Scotland want then fair dues to them. They voted as a country to Remain so if they vote to leave the UK in order to stay in the EU so be it. I don't have a problem with that.
All this pathetic talk about breaking up the union is a load of sentimental claptrap. It should be for the people of those nations to decide.

Of course if they voted for independence we could always deny them by saying:
it was illegal
they told porkies
the Russians were involved
they spent more more than they should
their buses had rude messages on the back
it was a full moon
etc etc

[oldbluefox]

Some American was on TV last week bleating on about Brexit and the commentator asked if America would ever sign away their legislation to a foreign body?
You can guess that the guy could not answer.

Barney, that's very similar to the situation when Remainer MPs are asked what options they would put on the ballot paper in the event of a second referendum. They don't know and cannot answer. It is excruciating to watch them struggle. I presume they are not the ones who consult Jack for advice?

[Jack Staff]

You are as ambiguous as usual Jack, but for the point of clarity, do you consider all 17.4 million people who voted to leave the EU as 'Brexiteers' ?

No

Do you consider all who voted to leave as 'causing damage' ?

Unwittingly, yes.

[Jack Staff]

Barney, that's very similar to the situation when Remainer MPs are asked what options they would put on the ballot paper in the event of a second referendum. They don't know and cannot answer. It is excruciating to watch them struggle. I presume they are not the ones who consult Jack for advice?

A remainer wants "Remain" on the ballot.
It is up to the Brexiters to decide what else is on there, but as always they are found wanting.

[oldbluefox]

If I were to devise the ballot there would be two options:
No deal
Deal

Remain would not be an option. That has already been decided.

However your idea it is up to Brexiters to decide their side of the ballot merely demonstrates how out of touch with the real world you are. What do your MPs who consult you think it should be? What about the forum members you represent?

[Jack Staff]

If I were to devise the ballot there would be two options:
No deal
Deal

Remain would not be an option. That has already been decided.

No surprise there. Anyone with a different opinion should shut up?

However your idea it is up to Brexiters to decide their side of the ballot merely demonstrates how out of touch with the real world you are. What do your MPs who consult you think it should be? What about the forum members you represent?

Hardly. Because you can't decide, you all want different things.
Are we now down to just belittling?

[Gill W]

"Two years notice - yet 10 weeks before we leave, we still have no idea on what basis we're going to leave."

Yes Gill, but that is not the fault of the people who voted to leave.
That is the fault of those who failed to implement it.

Every single MP, protestor and political agitator who have done their level best to oppose the result of the referendum at every turn, will bare the blame if it does all go t*ts up.

Some are STILL trying to re-run the referendum for God's sake
It wasn't fair !
It was the Russians
blah blah blah.

Who was talking about 'fault'? Not me

Then you go on to blame. I said a couple of days ago, you were obsessed with blame, and I stand by that, as you bring it up at every opportunity.

You omitted that Vote Leave broke the law.

[oldbluefox]

Are we now down to just belittling?

Some of the arguments you put forward are so preposterous are you surprised I don't take them seriously? I was just curious to know what the MPs who consult you think about it......... Would you care to tell us who they are?

[Jack Staff]

Are we now down to just belittling?

Some of the arguments you put forward are so preposterous are you surprised I don't take them seriously? I was just curious to know what the MPs who consult you think about it......... Would you care to tell us who they are?

Would you care to tell us when I actually said that MP's consult me? Or are you just making it up?

[Ray Scully]

Barney, just out of interest where do you stand on; reserving sunbeds, smoking on balconies, and tips included with the fare?

[Onelife]

Barney, just out of interest where do you stand on; reserving sunbeds, smoking on balconies, and tips included with the fare?

With respect Ray, l think you should be addressing the sunbed question to Jack as he loves everything Germany/European

[Onelife]

"Two years notice - yet 10 weeks before we leave, we still have no idea on what basis we're going to leave."

Yes Gill, but that is not the fault of the people who voted to leave.
That is the fault of those who failed to implement it.

Every single MP, protestor and political agitator who have done their level best to oppose the result of the referendum at every turn, will bare the blame if it does all go t*ts up.

Some are STILL trying to re-run the referendum for God's sake
It wasn't fair !
It was the Russians
blah blah blah.

Who was talking about 'fault'? Not me

Then you go on to blame. I said a couple of days ago, you were obsessed with blame, and I stand by that, as you bring it up at every opportunity.

You omitted that Vote Leave broke the law.

If we are playing the blame game then look no further than those MP'S who voted against what their constituencies voted for.

[Manoverboard]

Barney, just out of interest where do you stand on; reserving sunbeds, smoking on balconies, and tips included with the fare?

I stand full square on those but I can't be arsed with showing my passport everywhere I go …. hang on that is exactly what we had to do when we toured the Yugo regions

ps …. did it never occur to you or Gill that we ran out of some medicines even when we were a part of the EU … no, of course not.

[oldbluefox]

Are we now down to just belittling?

Some of the arguments you put forward are so preposterous are you surprised I don't take them seriously? I was just curious to know what the MPs who consult you think about it......... Would you care to tell us who they are?

Would you care to tell us when I actually said that MP's consult me? Or are you just making it up?

You said it a few months back. Are you now denying it?

[Jack Staff]

Some of the arguments you put forward are so preposterous are you surprised I don't take them seriously? I was just curious to know what the MPs who consult you think about it......... Would you care to tell us who they are?

Would you care to tell us when I actually said that MP's consult me? Or are you just making it up?

You said it a few months back. Are you now denying it?

Yes, show us please.
Or some might think you are providing bovine by-products.

[oldbluefox]

Are we now down to just belittling?

Some of the arguments you put forward are so preposterous are you surprised I don't take them seriously? I was just curious to know what the MPs who consult you think about it......... Would you care to tell us who they are?

Would you care to tell us when I actually said that MP's consult me? Or are you just making it up?

You said it a few months back. Are you now denying it? I think sometimes you forget what you have said and what you haven't. Do you still think the leave vote in the north all came from the middle classes?

[Jack Staff]

If we are playing the blame game then look no further than those MP'S who voted against what their constituencies voted for.

Kate Hoey
Victoria Borwick
Roger Godsiff
Anne Main
David Burrowes
Graham Brady
Peter Lilley
Theresa Villiers
Tom Elliott
...
It's a very long list, but that is enough for now.

[barney]

I can't comment on up north but I lived in Kent at the time of the vote and every area bar Royal Tunbridge Wells voted to leave. Kent is relatively affluent so nothing to do with social deprivation.

[oldbluefox]

The Leave vote in the north largely came from the more deprived areas, mostly Labour strongholds, apart from the big cities.