Brexit

[Ray Scully]

bug*er Brexit I have just spent 8 days as an emergency gest of the NHS

As you correctly say, Ray, bug*er Brexit.

Get well soon

Thanks, Moby

[oldbluefox]

Pleased to see that when you were so poorly you chose to Remain. At least on this occasion you made the right decision!!!
Get well soon
s&f
Foxylocks

[Jack Staff]

It's not Raab's ignorance about the Dover/Calais border that frightens me the most.
It's his failure to understand why admitting it in public would be such a pant-wettingly stupid thing to do.
{James O'Brien}

[Manoverboard]

Are you OFF Topic Jack ?

[barney]

https://www.politico.eu/article/epp-deb ... tion-2019/

So, Manfred Weber gets the job of President of the commission.

Just as well we are leaving in March.
Weber is notoriously anti UK.

[Gill W]

bug*er Brexit I have just spent 8 days as an emergency gest of the NHS

On no, hope you are feeling better

Just a tad Gill, allowed home today. pancreatitis. will have to cancel our Dec Azura trip

That's a real shame. Perhaps you'll be able to rebook for early next year. I don't know if the ships are still in the Caribbean at the end of March, but might be a good time to go !

[Gill W]

It's not Raab's ignorance about the Dover/Calais border that frightens me the most.
It's his failure to understand why admitting it in public would be such a pant-wettingly stupid thing to do.
{James O'Brien}

I suppose the plus point is, we now know that Raab realises we are an island

[barney]

It's not Raab's ignorance about the Dover/Calais border that frightens me the most.
It's his failure to understand why admitting it in public would be such a pant-wettingly stupid thing to do.
{James O'Brien}

I suppose the plus point is, we now know that Raab realises we are an island

Very soon to be an Independent Island and no longer a cash cow for Brussels

[Gill W]

d) None of the above.

What IS the reason?

Not really sure why you asked the question or why the emphasis in your reply to me. I think barney answered this very succinctly in his post which I have copied for you:
"As far as I'm concerned, the elephant in the room is what the EU intends to become, and that is never discussed by either side.
At the moment, it's speculation as is almost all of the Remain arguments, but the EU intentions have been very widely publicized.
To pretend that the EU will stay the same is like trying to pretend that it it what we joined all of those years ago.
To gauge current opinion depends entirely on what question you ask.
How about
Leave the EU and determine our own future
or
Remain in the EU, be ruled by Brussels and continue to pay in even increasing amounts of tax payers money while collaborating in robbing eastern Europe of the youngest and brightest people and admitting more and more supplicant poor counties looking for hand outs.
Has a slightly different ring to it ?
If the UK does not take this opportunity now, it will be buried for ever and our descendants will question why we did not leave when we had the chance".

It was an open question to anybody who cared to answer, but as you had added your own option, it just so happened it appeared in my answer to you.

Barney's reply doesn't help at all. I was wondering why we need to be talking about Federalism at all at this point. We are leaving the EU on 29th March 2019, so it's immaterial to us what the EU's plans are, as we won't be part of the EU any more.

I was speculating why the Brexit contingent feel the need to carry on up this particular avenue and these are my suggestions for a reason

a) still trying to justify their vote. (there's no need for this, we are beyond that stage now.)
b) Trying to get Remainers round to their way of thinking. (we are also beyond that stage, as views are entrenched)
c) using this as a displacement activity, to try and not think about the UK being in a crisis situation)

We've now gone round in a complete circle, and I'm still none the wiser

[Jack Staff]

Are you OFF Topic Jack ?

I don't think so, check it out for yourself .... https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/p ... 24036.html

It's pretty certain Raab C Brexit hasn't got an 'O' level in geography.

[towny44]

d) None of the above.

What IS the reason?

Not really sure why you asked the question or why the emphasis in your reply to me. I think barney answered this very succinctly in his post which I have copied for you:
"As far as I'm concerned, the elephant in the room is what the EU intends to become, and that is never discussed by either side.
At the moment, it's speculation as is almost all of the Remain arguments, but the EU intentions have been very widely publicized.
To pretend that the EU will stay the same is like trying to pretend that it it what we joined all of those years ago.
To gauge current opinion depends entirely on what question you ask.
How about
Leave the EU and determine our own future
or
Remain in the EU, be ruled by Brussels and continue to pay in even increasing amounts of tax payers money while collaborating in robbing eastern Europe of the youngest and brightest people and admitting more and more supplicant poor counties looking for hand outs.
Has a slightly different ring to it ?
If the UK does not take this opportunity now, it will be buried for ever and our descendants will question why we did not leave when we had the chance".

It was an open question to anybody who cared to answer, but as you had added your own option, it just so happened it appeared in my answer to you.

Barney's reply doesn't help at all. I was wondering why we need to be talking about Federalism at all at this point. We are leaving the EU on 29th March 2019, so it's immaterial to us what the EU's plans are, as we won't be part of the EU any more.

I was speculating why the Brexit contingent feel the need to carry on up this particular avenue and these are my suggestions for a reason

a) still trying to justify their vote. (there's no need for this, we are beyond that stage now.)
b) Trying to get Remainers round to their way of thinking. (we are also beyond that stage, as views are entrenched)
c) using this as a displacement activity, to try and not think about the UK being in a crisis situation)

We've now gone round in a complete circle, and I'm still none the wiser

Gill, the remain contingent on here keep questioning why the brexiteers voted to leave your cosy club, which is why we keep telling you its because we did not want to go down the EU federal route. And regardless of how many times you question why, the answer will remain the same, which is why we rarely ask you why you want to stay in the club.

[Jack Staff]

[
It was an open question to anybody who cared to answer, but as you had added your own option, it just so happened it appeared in my answer to you.

Barney's reply doesn't help at all. I was wondering why we need to be talking about Federalism at all at this point. We are leaving the EU on 29th March 2019, so it's immaterial to us what the EU's plans are, as we won't be part of the EU any more.

I was speculating why the Brexit contingent feel the need to carry on up this particular avenue and these are my suggestions for a reason

a) still trying to justify their vote. (there's no need for this, we are beyond that stage now.)
b) Trying to get Remainers round to their way of thinking. (we are also beyond that stage, as views are entrenched)
c) using this as a displacement activity, to try and not think about the UK being in a crisis situation)

We've now gone round in a complete circle, and I'm still none the wiser

They would say the EU will eat our first born to try and keep their fantasy alive.

[oldbluefox]

d) None of the above.

What IS the reason?

Not really sure why you asked the question or why the emphasis in your reply to me. I think barney answered this very succinctly in his post which I have copied for you:
"As far as I'm concerned, the elephant in the room is what the EU intends to become, and that is never discussed by either side.
At the moment, it's speculation as is almost all of the Remain arguments, but the EU intentions have been very widely publicized.
To pretend that the EU will stay the same is like trying to pretend that it it what we joined all of those years ago.

When we voted to leave the EU we were not solely concerned about trade and the customs union which is where Remainers seem to be stuck. It was about much more than that and the idea of federalism did not appeal. Jack seems to think all will be well as we have a veto but you only need clowns like Major and Bliar who would happily concede to the EU and we would find ourselves more entrenched in the EU than we are now. I realise the Remain camp do not like us to talk about the EU's future intentions but there are plenty of references from different quarters. Just have a look at what Macron and Verhofstadt are proposing.
On one aspect you are correct. Once we are out of the EU it will not matter what the rest of the EU are doing. That is ONE reason why I voted to leave. Remain means much more than free trade and customs union.
I hope that has answered your question but I think barney put it much better than I have.

[oldbluefox]

They would say the EU will eat our first born to try and keep their fantasy alive.

As the one drafted in to represent other forum members is that the best you can come up with? I realise the Remain camp would prefer not to look too far into the future ambitions of the EU.

[Manoverboard]

Are you OFF Topic Jack ?

I don't think so, check it out for yourself .... https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/p ... 24036.html

It's pretty certain Raab C Brexit hasn't got an 'O' level in geography.

It was a joke Jack, I was implying that the Topic was about Ray rather than Brexit, hence the 'wink '.

Sorry to confuse n

[oldbluefox]

There is quite a lot of confusion in the Remain camp.
On PMQ last week an SNP MP got up to bemoan the fact that when we leave the EU his family would be broken up as his wife (as an EU 'migrant') would have to return home.
He had to be assured that EU nationals currently in the UK would not be asked to return home. As an MP he clearly did not have a clue and it makes you wonder what he is telling his constituents.

[Jack Staff]

They would say the EU will eat our first born to try and keep their fantasy alive.

As the one drafted in to represent other forum members is that the best you can come up with? I realise the Remain camp would prefer not to look too far into the future ambitions of the EU.

No, I did a bit better previously, but as you didn't read it, here it is again

While there are some people who would like a federal Europe, there are many that don't. The EU is democratic, so can't happen until people want it.
But, while we remain members we have a veto on this and can stop it. Once (if) we leave we then have no say in the future of the EU and when we rejoin we will have to take on whatever has be decided in our absence and with no veto on future decisions.

We are not in Schengen, or the Euro because we don't want to be.

For there to be a federal Europe the budget must be expanded greatly, there are obviously many member states that are not to keen on that.

The formation of the EU is that member states form the rules. Can't see many of them giving that up.

As a member of the Remain camp I am very happy to look to the future of the EU. I see it as a group able to stand up to the bullies of Trump, Putin and Xi, something we can not do on our own.

[Jack Staff]

There is quite a lot of confusion in the Remain camp.
On PMQ last week an SNP MP got up to bemoan the fact that when we leave the EU his family would be broken up as his wife (as an EU 'migrant') would have to return home.
He had to be assured that EU nationals currently in the UK would not be asked to return home. As an MP he clearly did not have a clue and it makes you wonder what he is telling his constituents.

There is quite a lot of confusion in the Brexit camp.
The MP is right to be worried.
The situation is dependant on 'the deal'. As we all know, as yet, there is no deal.
I think you will find that his wife thought she was home.

[oldbluefox]

Not true Jack. I think your Remainer handbook is out of date. It looks like our SNP friend may have the same copy.

https://ec.europa.eu/unitedkingdom/serv ... /Brexit_en

[Jack Staff]

Not true Jack. I think your Remainer handbook is out of date. It looks like our SNP friend may have the same copy.

https://ec.europa.eu/unitedkingdom/serv ... /Brexit_en

Not true Foxy
Like I said...
"This present document interprets the Joint Report for information purposes only and should not be understood as the final text of the Withdrawal Agreement."

[oldbluefox]

Where is the link Jack?

[Jack Staff]

Where is the link Jack?

It is the document you quoted. Your link.
Did you not read it before you posted?

[Stephen]

Not true Jack. I think your Remainer handbook is out of date. It looks like our SNP friend may have the same copy.

https://ec.europa.eu/unitedkingdom/serv ... /Brexit_en

Sorry Jack, I just found it amusing

[Jack Staff]

"
Christopher Columbus Raab, having discovered France, is now setting off in search of Ireland.
‘Robbins & Barnier tell me there is a problematic land to the west. But I think it’s another one of their plots, so I am making a secret trip to expose the truth!’
"
{Adonis}

[Golden Princess]

Ray, so sorry to see you have been so poorly. Glad you are home. Take care and take it easy.
Plenty of cruises to choose from next year and the next.